Hire an attorney who specializes in the type of dispute you have.
A common mistake I see people make when faced with a legal challenge is hiring a lawyer who doesn’t specialize in the legal area. When you have an estate issue, you hire an estate attorney. When you set up a company, you hire a corporate attorney. So when you have a domain name issue, you hire an attorney that specializes in domain names. Don’t just use the attorney you used to set up your business.
If you hire an attorney specializing in several things, they probably aren’t specialized enough to handle a domain name dispute. Even some trademark attorneys aren’t the right lawyer for a UDRP or cybersquatting dispute; you should hire someone who has already handled many such cases.
Earlier today, Nat Cohen tweeted:
Telepathy is fortunate to have been represented by several of the top minds in domain name law, including Zak Muscovitch (@DNattorney) , Ari Goldberger (@esqwire), Jason Schaeffer (@TLDadvisor), John Berryhill (@Berryhillj) and David Weslow (@DavidWeslow). /2
— Nat Cohen (@domainarts) March 31, 2021
Nat has seen his share of spurious claims against his domain names because he has such a valuable portfolio. He turns to attorneys who have deal with domain disputes to help him defend his domain assets.
There are several reasons to hire an attorney who has a lot of history with domain disputes if you ever face a challenge to one of your domains. If you hire a lawyer without deep existing knowledge of this specialty, then:
1. You are paying the lawyer to learn this area of law. You will rack up billable hours of them researching how UDRP or cybersquatting laws work.
2. They won’t understand the nuance of these cases. Skilled UDRP lawyers know the right buttons to push — and just how far — when arguing a case.
3. They don’t know the history by memory. Lawyers with UDRP experience understand the individual panelists and which cases to refer to. They either have a database or know which cases to cite by memory.
Most importantly, a good domain attorney can tell you whether you have a good case or not!
bizstarz says
Good info, but this story and/or Nat Cohen should address the elephant in the room: how much do these “skilled UDRP lawyers” charge?
Logan says
The same per hour as any specialist attorney – several hundreds of USD. You get what you pay for.
bizstarz says
Get off your high horse. As is often reported – including by Susan Cartier Liebel, the founder & CEO of Solo Practice University – 80% of individuals and small businesses can’t afford a “regular” attorney, let alone a team of the most skilled and costly attorneys. And even if they can, this story should at least say about how much it costs total, not by the hour, to hire “skilled UDRP lawyers” for a UDRP case. If it costs $15k or more, then it may not make sense to hire an attorney at all to fight for a low value domain name. It’s also naive to claim that you always get what you pay for, especially when it comes to legal services.
John Berryhill says
“this story should at least say about how much it costs total”
Let me ask you something. If you charge $100 per hour and I give you a shovel, then how much is it going to cost to dig a hole?
It’s going to depend on what size hole we’re talking about, and what kind of soil or rock we’re digging into.
In a UDRP dispute, one of the first decisions, for example, is whether to use a three member panel if the complainant has selected a single member panel. That decision right there is worth $2000 at WIPO, $1350 at NAF and $1260 at CIIDRC.
Out of hundreds of cases, the lowest overall cost was $0, the highest might have been as unusually high as $8k with protracted rounds of argument and a lawsuit filed while the case proceeded. There have been a few circumstances where people have offered a portion of an ultimately settlement or sale value in payment of all or part of that cost, but zero of those have ever turned out to be a good idea.
I doubt Andrew has had occasion to defend very many domain names, so he probably has no idea.
I will say this, though, if you are hit with a UDRP and you start receiving emails from someone who has done zero to a handful of cases, and their email or website goes on about how great they are and how they always win, then hold onto your wallet and run.
bizstarz says
Thanks, John.
“Out of hundreds of cases, the lowest overall cost was $0, the highest might have been as unusually high as $8k with protracted rounds of argument and a lawsuit filed while the case proceeded.”
Of course no cases are exactly alike. But that info provides enough detail for a reasonable person to at least have a rough idea of what a UDRP case might cost them if they hire someone of your caliber. And I imagine some attorneys charge hourly, and some charge flat rates.
Andrew Allemann says
The biggest determinant of pricing I find between lawyers is if they work for themselves or for a large firm. Several domain name lawyers have very affordable fees. And they’re efficient, too, because they have the specialty knowledge for how to respond to disputes. You should be able to defend a UDRP for $4k-$7k if it’s not too complex.
John Berryhill says
Degree of complexity is a big part of it.
One of the advantages of doing these regularly is that there is a handful of basic fact patterns. What that means is that an attorney who has done of bunch of these has, in all probability, already done a case that is a lot like yours. As you note, it’s pretty easy to cite to relevant prior decisions when they were your cases to begin with.
Every case is different, to an extent, because every domain name is unique. But frequently the degree of effort is also a function of what sort of job was done on the complaint. A lot of complaints are poorly done by an in-house employee who doesn’t know what they are doing. Some complaints are weak, but were written by someone who does know better on the calculation that if the respondent doesn’t default, then they’ll shore it up in a supplement.
But I get these kinds of “how much do you charge for a UDRP” emails from time to time and my usual response is along the lines of “about as much as it costs to fix a car, depending on the car and what’s wrong with it.”
bizstarz says
Thanks, Andrew! That’s surely very helpful and appreciated info for your readers.
Though affordability is relative. $4k-$7k for legal fees they likely won’t get back even if they “win,” can make or break a small start-up business that has lots of other expenses but is not making much if any money yet (especially during COVID).
And tons, if not most, solo attorneys have unprofessional DIY websites because they won’t/can’t pay a professional web designer. Attorneys are notoriously “frugal,” but often won’t pay for professional services.
An amazing amount of trademark attorneys don’t even have trademarks for their own firm’s names (I know surname trademarks are unique, but that’s not a good excuse).
bizstarz says
Andrew, if you look into the “skilled UDRP lawyers” mentioned in your article, it appears that only one of their firms practices what they preach (hire professionals and have/protect your trademarks), Wiley Rein LLP.
The rest don’t seem to have federally registered (or registrable?) trademarks for their law firms, and one has an incredibly outdated/unprofessional website.
An article about IP attorneys or firms w/out trademarks or modern/professional websites could be quite interesting and informative.
Andrew Allemann says
Why would they need a trademark for their law firm?
And if you get all of your business from word of mouth, you probably don’t need a fancy website.
bizstarz says
“Why would they need a trademark for their law firm?”
For the same reasons they advise other businesses to pay them many 1000s of dollars to get and defend trademarks? Maybe you could interview law firms that do and don’t have trademarks for their names for their reasoning (and ask businesses that have hired trademark attorneys).
“And if you get all of your business from word of mouth, you probably don’t need a fancy website.”
I never said a “fancy” website. If you charge 1,000 for professional services, you should invest in a professional website. You don’t find it hypocritical for a domain name / trademark attorney to have an unprofessional domain/website and/or to not have a trademarked name? Would you trust / pay a dentist who has bad teeth from poor dental hygiene? BTW, an attorney I know very well told me he couldn’t believe how much better his very small firm is doing since finally paying for a professional website.
And if an attorney isn’t willing or able to pay for a web designer, what other tech or resources is he/she unwilling or unable to pay for? Probably quite a few other things. Very risky these days, i.e. e-discovery issues and increasing amount of bar assns requiring attorneys to keep up with tech. I’ve seen it firsthand by my own and other attorneys. They’re Luddites and in my opinion it’s best to avoid them.
Hope this is helpful!
josh says
Great article, agree fully.